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Baz Ratner / Reuters
An employee of the Israeli Antiquities Authority displays figurines at Tel Motza archaeological site on the outskirts of Jerusalem.
Archaeologists have uncovered a 2,750-year-old temple near Jerusalem, along with pottery and clay figurines that suggest the site was the home base for a ritual cult, the Israeli Antiquities Authority said Wednesday.
The discovery was made during excavations at the Tel Motza archaeological site, about 3 miles (5 kilometers) west of Jerusalem, during preparations for work on a new section of Israeli's Highway 1, the agency said in a statement.
"The ritual building at Tel Motza is an unusual and striking find, in light of the fact that there are hardly any remains of ritual buildings of the period in Judaea at the time of the First Temple," excavation directors Anna Eirikh, Hamoudi Khalaily and Shua Kisilevitz were quoted as saying in the statement.
The Bible says the First Temple was built in Jerusalem by Solomon, son of King David, and archaeologists estimate that construction was undertaken in the 10th century B.C. The excavation's directors say the Tel Motza temple must have been active in an era "prior to the religious reforms throughout the kingdom at the end of the monarchic period (at the time of Hezekiah and Isaiah), which abolished all ritual sites, concentrating ritual practices solely at the Temple in Jerusalem."
Tel Motza was thought to be associated with the ancient settlement called "Mozah" in the Book of Joshua. During previous work, archaeologists uncovered a large structure with storehouses and a number of silos. They said that structure might have served as a storage facility for Jerusalem's grain supplies.
Baz Ratner / Reuters
Archaeologist Anna Eirikh displays a horse figurine at Tel Motza archaeological site on the outskirts of Jerusalem.
Skyview / IAA
An overhead view shows the Tel Motza archaeological site.
The newly discovered structure has massive walls and a wide, east-facing entrance, conforming to the tradition of temple construction at the time, the site directors said. "The rays of the sun rising in the east would have illuminated the object placed inside the temple first, symbolizing the divine presence within," they said.
Inside the temple, archaeologists found what appeared to be a square altar, with a cache of ritual items nearby. Those items included fragments of pottery chalices, decorated ritual pedestals and two types of pottery figurines. Some of the figurines represented animals — mainly horses in harnesses— while others were humanlike heads with curling hair and flat headdresses. Such figurines hint at the influence of Philistine coastal culture.
"The find of the sacred structure, together with the accompanying cache of sacred vessels, and especially the significant coastal influence evident in the anthropomorphic figurines, still require extensive research," the directors said.
More about Jewish archaeology:
- 9,000-year-old charms found in Israel
- Artifacts reveal history behind David and Goliath
- In Israel, diggers unearth the Bible's bad guys
- Professor hunts for 'Lost Ark of the Covenant'
- Gallery: Eight Jewish archaeological discoveries
- Cosmic Log archive on archaeology
Alan Boyle is NBCNews.com's science editor. Connect with the Cosmic Log community by "liking" the log's Facebook page, following @b0yle on Twitter and adding the Cosmic Log page to your Google+ presence. To keep up with Cosmic Log as well as NBCNews.com's other stories about science and space, sign up for the Tech & Science newsletter, delivered to your email in-box every weekday. You can also check out "The Case for Pluto," my book about the controversial dwarf planet and the search for new worlds.
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I hope the continued evidence of Jewish presence in Jerusalem will continue to put a SHAME on all those so call Palestinians, who are nothing but Arabs settlers, which claim any part of Eretz Israel, as their land. That is why they are so afraid of any archeological dig in West Bank, as if that will wipe out years of Jewish History. As far as I am concern, G-D HAS GIVEN ERETZ ISRAEL to Bet Yaakov, as an EVERLASTING POSSESSION. That is why there will never be a Palestinian State. Moreover, those Arab Settlers will continue to miss every opportunity presented to them.
So true. But we also must acknowledge that this piece of land now has been hotly contested and switched ownership many times. Still, the Jews do own it now and have the most evidence on ancient ownership.
"Evidence", you say. What evidence? Your post is evidence about YOU.
And a very fine good morning to you, J.P. I see that you found an article on Israel (what a surprise) and have come in to spread your usual
hate mongeringwell wishes and cheer.***yawn***
ON TOPIC These findings are always fascinating and wonderful news. Hope to see updates on this as more information becomes available.
And yet you feel no SHAME for the fact that your religious ancestors invaded North America, slaughtered and imprisoned millions of the native American peoples who had been living here since 10,000 BC.
How ironic. Maybe you'll claim that "God" gave you North America.
....
Must always chuckle when artifacts found nearly always point to 'ritual' 'ceremonial' 'religious' enterprises. If anyone excavates one of our dumps and finds doll heads and toilet seats these will be proclaimed as ritual items. The doll heads representing deities and the toilet seats were worn during ceremonial procedures.
Nice pagan temple discovered... with graven images and all... ah.. these were the good old days, when nobody was fighting over religious ideas...
They're not really holy, it's just the porous stone.
Ifeanyi-2726509 really, so your ok with humans today suffering over some piece of land occupied hundreds of years ago...talk about superiority. Who cares who lived their once long ago....there are real live humans today that need homes, schools, and love from everyone. This GPS superiority has got to stop...I love history and I like learning about it, but the truth is we are savoring a very evil period of time where humans were killed, sacrificed and worse....just to be reliving it today all over again. NO, NOT one GPS location is worth a life...that is what our great ONE would have done for us had HE been here now...he would clear those old pieces of stuff and make way for families and all humans. I do not believe any one single group is HIS people, that is very narcissistic...we are ALL in this together
So how do you decide which groups of people deserve freedom and which do not? language? color? size? money? And some day when your people fall victim to this, what will you say? how will you feel? Because if the palestinians can be treated this way, SO can YOU.
Great! A new temple discovered near Jerusalem!
Now everybody can begin arguing and fighting over this newly discovered trash.
In fact, if you read some of the posts above, you'll see that the arguing and fighting has already begun.
FEDFL,
"And yet you feel no SHAME for the fact that your religious ancestors invaded North America, slaughtered and imprisoned millions of the native American peoples who had been living here since 10,000 BC."
The idea that I should feel shame for what my ancestors did is absolutely idiotic. I am responsible for my own actions; not those of my ancestors. I did not even exist then, so how could I be responsible for what they did that I should feel any shame? There is nothing I could possibly have done to have prevented them from doing what they did.
While these discoveries are fantastic in that they provide information about the people who lived in the area at the time, I do not see them as have having much bearing on claims to the land now. Land has changed hands between different peoples and countries for thousands of years for various reasons, including natural migration, extinction of the original inhabitants, wars, etc. To ignore this reality makes absolutely no sense. To use the idea of who was there first as a basis for modern claims is somewhat absurd. If you were to follow that premise, then everyone who is not of Native American descent should be forced to leave the US. We need to look at rights to land with a more modern view and stop this bickering over who was there first and ancestral claims. Until we get past this type of nonsense claims there will never be peace in the region. Whether some people like it or not, the Palestinians as they call themselves need a place to live that they can call their own. The leaders of Israel recognize this fact. The only issue becomes agreeing on the boundaries. The sooner the fanatics like Hamas and other extremist Palestinian faction give up on the idea of this ancient right of return the sooner real, peaceful negotiations can move forward to end the conflict once and for all and reach agreement on a border between these two parties.
FEDEFL- In respoonse to your comment. So true. I am 50% German and 50% Blackfoot Indian. The American people sometimes forget or show no remorse,or regrets for the past history of this country of the Native Americans. Wheresjesus in response to your comment. I don't think it was a dumb comment. I thought it was a reminder of this country's own past and shall not forget it like the Jewish people are doing. There should be no difference. Both sides show of a reminder.
Jerusalem is a holy city for Christians, Jews, and Muslims. Why not simply give it its own autonomy and create a separate city-state there, in much the same way that the Vatican is separate and independent of any secular state? While Israel would not be able to claim it as theirs, neither will Palestine--it would belong to everyone.
Now granted, I haven't studied up on the history of the region (and probably should) but IF the root of the conflict is that each country wants to be able to claim Jerusalem as theirs, and no compromise or resolution has been reached in all these years, then perhaps simply creating Jerusalem as its own autonomous city-state might work?
Are they not first and foremost "Human" settlers?
Here's a novel idea, how about for a change (in the 21st @!$%#ing century no less), we realize we all share one common bound that's much more stronger than our ancient faiths, the pigmentation in our skin, or the language we were taught through mere accidence of birth?
Our nation states and country outlines are ILLUSIONS. Get over yourselves and join the rest of humanity. Or, should we just keep continuing to kill ourselves over ancient superstitions and patches of desert?
If you look at a map you'll see how the Palestine region is the land bridge between the continent of Africa and Asia. This is the land where over 70,000 years ago our ancestors from Africa went through on their journey to the rest of the world.
This is the land where agriculture was first practice by humans over 10,000 years ago and where soon after the first city in the world was built, Jericho.
This is the land where for tens of thousands of years millions of humans went back and forth to do business, or escaping wars, or just looking for a different place to live.
You've got to be deaf, dumb and blind to think that after all that history Palestine did not developed its own native population.
Why is it so easy for Israel supporters in the US to be in denial like this? How can so many Americans believe their own lies about Palestinians, and why do they insist in telling Palestinians who they are, what their history is and what doesn't belong to them?
WTH is wrong with them?
JS in SD
The world needs to wake up to the true facts.... There can never be true peace in Israel or any place else until the Man of Peace, Christ Jesus is seated upon His Throne and the nations made His footstool. God gave the promise land to the Israelites because of the sins of those that presided over that area at that time... And in my heart, though I can not prove it until I get to heaven, I believe He did the same here in America...
An archaeological find in an area rich with the historical development of modern man and right away the anti Semites are out bashing Jews, we don't know a lot about it or exactly what civilization they are from but again mention Israel and the Antisemitism begins. One thing we do know is if the Islamists were in control the site and the relics would be destroyed by the religion of pieces, just like the Buddhist statues in Afghanistan, if I recall the location correctly.
that there might be some of my ancestors stuff...artifacts look like an old one hitter bong thingy...
plain bob
LMAO
AGAIN with the comment collapsing. @ Newsvine mods, I have a suggestion, the rrot post on a thread should not be able to be collapsed regardless of its popularity, divisiveness, unpopularity, stupidity or ignorance. Not saying that I attribute any to this particular thread, just a general statement.
@Amanda - Your idea has been floated many times and has been the stance of a good part of the international community since 1948. Currently, the UN and most of the international community considers Jerusalem to be a separate entity from any country and rejects Israel's claim of Jerusalem as its capital. However, as recently as this year, Obama has voiced US support for Jerusalem as the capital of Israel, but the US embassy remains in Tel Aviv. It is highly doubtful that Israel will ever agree to give up Jerusalem as their capital, although over the years a few Israeli leaders have voiced a willingness to allow at least part of it to be a separate entity. That said, the current Israeli leadership is firmly against any division or relinquishment of Jerusalem as their capital.
However one feels about Jerusalem please keep in mind that Biblical Jerusalem, at its height, was only 15 acres big. What's happened recently is that Israel has confiscated some 10% of West Bank land, mainly surrounding the East Jerusalem and Bethlehem areas, and has made it part of Jerusalem when in fact it never was.
Another thing to keep in mind is that it was the Canaanites who founded Jerusalem at least 800 years before any Jews set foot on it.
Israel needs to come to its senses and implement UN resolution 242 at long last.
EDIT
the rrot post on a thread
should read, the root post on a thread
True, and right now we can see America slowly being taken over by socialists and driven into bankruptcy. But maybe global warming will raise the oceans enough to slow this creeping socialism (as most of the libbies live coastal states like California or NY! lol, sarc/
all kidding aside, I do worry for the future of our children and grandchildren, we're leaving them a terrible mess!
Amanda ....JS in SD
Jerusalem and its environs (Judea and Samaria)was protected by the UN. Muslim Armies of Jordan Attacked and conquered it in 1948. Liberated for the World by Israel in 1967.
Antistupidity:
As Christianity spreads in African lands, new converts are being encouraged to bring out artifacts and talismans that have belonged to their tribes and ancestors for centuries and burn or destroy them as proof of their devotion and commitment to Christianity. Many of these items being burned have centuries of use behind them, and are of great anthropological significance as well as being handmade objects and beautiful works of art in and of themselves. These have now been lost to history.
Throughout human history whenever a new belief system spread into an area and overcomes the old, artifacts and symbols of the old belief system are destroyed. This is no more exclusive to the Muslims than it is to the Jews, Christians, and every other religious practitioner throughout time has done the same thing.
My belief system says 'It's what you do that matters, not whose Name you do it in'.
JS in SD, it is useful to add to your comment that when parts of Jerusalem were controlled by the local Muslim population, Jews and Christians were not allowed access to their holy sites. I think that the autonomy of Jerusalem would be a less heated debate if the Israelis felt any sense of security in relinquishing the control they currently have. Unfortunately, as seen various times that Israel has given land over to the local Muslim populations, the reality would probably result in further Muslim takeover and more land "off limits" to the Jewish population of Israel. See Hebron, as a prime example.
It's a rather profound difference between the Israelis and the Palestinians being shown here.
The Palestinians and Muslims destroy the religious history of other religions and the Israelis preserve them for posterity.
It seems the "Religion of Peace" is only peaceful after it destroys any evidence of other religions and has either forced the remaining people into the Muslim faith or killed them.
Amazing - the depths of your bull and self-delusion.
gsh341 is correct about the extreme muslims.
No, Israel is merely using such discoveries to promote their fairy tales of 'promised land' and other land grabbing excuses.
gsh341 - The religion of peace is even destroying other ancient muslim mausoleums in Timbuktu.
in the meantime, the other 'religion of peace' continues to steal land from their neighbors...
Abrahamic religions brought humanity more misery than hunger, disease, and natural disasters combined. Emancipate yourself from mental slavery... none but ourselves can free our minds...
Who says this has anything to do with Judaism or Islam? The fact that the discovery fits with 'the influence of Philistine coastal culture' speaks loudly to the phony claims of the Zionists that they own the land because their God told them they do! LOL
BTW, my God tells me I am a billionaire and so I can go the bank and get my money that is in your accounts tomorrow!
and then tonto told the lone ranger...the doctor say you gon'a die kimosabe...that there was the greatest punch line ever...
To "MAX^108": I'm not sure if you're a paid troll or not, but I will pray for you to know Jesus. Don't be afraid to confront your fears and sins. You WILL have to give an account to Him one day. Be prepared.
@Dave - I pray that Jesus forgives you your stupidity and lack of respect for fellow men and their beliefs. I pray that Jesus forgives his warmongering followers for all the misery they continue to bring to this world.
Peace, brother...
Gee, I wonder where Islam got those ideas?
Oh yeah, from its parents, Christianity and Judaism. Quoting from Exodus:
"Be careful not to make a treaty with those who live in the land where you are going, or they will be a snare among you. Break down their altars, smash their sacred stones and cut down their Asherah poles. Do not worship any other god, for the Lord, whose name is Jealous, is a jealous God.
“Be careful not to make a treaty with those who live in the land; for when they prostitute themselves to their gods and sacrifice to them, they will invite you and you will eat their sacrifices. And when you choose some of their daughters as wives for your sons and those daughters prostitute themselves to their gods, they will lead your sons to do the same."
...
"I will drive out nations before you and enlarge your territory, and no one will covet your land when you go up three times each year to appear before the Lord your God."
Good job Israeli archaeologists, what a great find!!!
Dave lotsanumbers, you wrote:
I know that wasn't directed to me, but I do know Jesus. His last name is Martinez, and he runs a small shop selling artifacts, and I swear the ones in the photo came from his store. Praise be to Jesus.
lol the few "artifacts" found that suggest a Jewish presence in the area have been debunked. In the meanwhile, you can't sink a shovel into the ground without finding Palestinians artifacts.
Israel is a rogue nation based on lies. Do your own research. Unwrap your programming.
Actually this confirms what the Bible says - that Solomon built pagan temples for all his wives which he was never supposed to marry in the first place because they were from the Canaanite nations around them, and then later kings failed to get rid of those temples and the associated idolatry, and that is the main reason given in the Bible for why Babylon conquered Israel and the first temple was destroyed. In the time of the second temple they were very sensitive to this because they understood this is why the Babylonian captivity happened. So no more pagan temples were allowed after that.
So very far from contradicting the truth of the first temple erra - it confirms it just as described in the Bible.
Collapse this: http://www.ifamericansknew.org/us_ints/history.html
Why destroy History simply for another highway????
Why keep destroying what we have ad what once was simply so tha drivers can find an easier path to where they are going?
gsh:
As Christianity now spreads on the African continent, new converts are being encouraged to bring out artifacts and talismans that have belonged to their tribes and ancestors for centuries and burn or destroy them as proof of their devotion and commitment to Christianity. altars are being pulled down, shamanic poles and grounds that have been held sacred since time immemorial are vanishing. Many of these items being burned have centuries of use behind them, and are of great anthropological significance as well as being handmade objects and beautiful works of art in and of themselves. These have now been lost to history.
Throughout human history whenever a new belief system spread into an area and overcomes the old, artifacts and symbols of the old belief system are destroyed. This is no more exclusive to the Muslims than it is to the Jews, Christians; and every other religious practitioner throughout time has done the same thing.
Sillyshrinks, they were not destroying the Temple they found in order to put in a new road. They discovered it while digging to lay the road's foundation - a big difference. All work stops when a they find artifacts, so that the archiologists can come in and do their thing.
I have Brazilian wedding bells that look just like those artifacts - made post 2000 AD.
No such thing as a "peaceful religion", for religion is of man and woman - and they sure as (fictional) Hell ain't peaceful. I'd like to go to heaven for a few days - just to narc-off all the self proclaimed do-gooders. Since Jesus looks like me - a long haired, bearded hippie who preaches peace - who do you think he will trust more - some redneck with a crew cut or me? LMAO!
@gsh341-
it is a rather small minority of extremist Muslims that believe it is necessary to destroy all 'graven images'. the greater group of Muslims doesn't advocate or actively practice any such thing. what you are doing is akin to saying that Tea Party beliefs are what all Republicans believe. or saying that Catholic beliefs, or Southern Baptist beliefs, represent what 'Christians' believe. making a sweeping generalization/condemnation merely labels you as an ignorant bigot. and I not am aware of Palestinians specifically destroying any religious artifacts- can you provide evidence to support that statement? I am aware that Christian missionaries have and still do encourage converts to surrender and/or destroy their 'pagan' religious paraphernalia to prove their adherence to Christianity.
Dave, why don't you shove your patronizing attitude and your little prayers right up where the sun don't shine. You people and your fairy tales and your fear-mongering, I swear. Here's a tip - anything you have to SCARE people into believing is usually a big, fat, manipulative lie.
FZ KNEW
The evil Jewish plotters did not have a meeting featuring a big capitalist Top Hat with a card affixed to it that reads: "Next Innocent Country for Us To Infest". Whereupon tzititzied and otherwise peyot-festooned provocateurs drew cards with names of countries to swarm to and overrun....then did so. Nor did they take a CLUB MED vacation to southern Syrio-Turkey...looked around, then decided to take over the joint. These are locations considered by the diplomatic community at the time. Toss in somewhere in Alaska and the Yukon. These are places with large swaths of unsettled or abandoned land. JUST like the "Holy Land". The place that produced the people that wrote the Hideous Original Testament. If you dont believe it the Smithsonian Institute has thousands of photos (and some of the earliest movies ever made) you can view them over the net.
http://www.israeldailypicture.com/
http://www.loc.gov/pictures/collection/matpc/bibliography.html
Meanwhile back to the evil Zionist conferences: They did have a conference several discussing the increasing genocidal pogroms in the Russias, the Drum-heading of a National hero; aka Dreyfus Affair, in the country where "NO man need fear another" and other anti-Semitic rumblings in the greater continent. The European diplomatic community was also aware at this alarming trend. They were discussing options to escape deadly persicution. They decided to start buying land in the "Old Country" the land of iron-fisted muslim rule and its imposed dhimmi persecutions: e.i, Judea and Samaria". Those Turkish land owners are the Muslims that you mentioned. They happily sold it to Jews for sums vastly larger than the actual prevailing going rate. The place was "empty as Frank's favorite word." Check out the Library of Congress's photo archive. It documents those Jews Arabs and Christians you bring up...AND the surrounding territory. You can also see "Fiddler on the Roof" for free on You Tube. If you like Musicals. FOTR also contains humerous protests aimed at God. Its more enlightening than one of my favs: Thing Fish".
...and thus would surely mod-ofied one of Frank's "Pet rants duJour: "the Sykes-Picot Agreement" The agreement that was later superseded by the Jewish Mandate then next: British Mandate for Palestine, THE WAR andultimately the Four victorious allied powers' treaty conference at San Remo, Ratification by the League of Nations. All of this existing agreements were upheld in the UN founding Charter Chapter 80
If Frank were alive to see Arafat ultimately leave Camp David & reject it despite Israeli acquiesce to 97% of his "demands"; the remaing 3% negotiable, THEN launch the 2nd intifada with it's women and children strapped with suicide bombs. The answer to, "What would ya do FRANKIE?" Would be what? Hmmmm?? The smart money would be: an opinion change, a dumb-all-over eye roll coupled with a zappa-esque, "screw 'em" (paraphrased).
Forget this High School 'vine and the "WikiPedia Prom. Go to the Library and Educate yourself.
Frank was right about that. I think Thats a good place for us to start.
Allie22
@gsh341-
it is a rather small minority of extremist Muslims that believe it is necessary to destroy all 'graven images'
The problem is the prescribed muslim response to infidels and their graven imiges is graven in stone, will always be alive FOR EVER and acted upon by any fluctuating muslim demographic. Reformation of that or any of Islam's " understood-to-be literal old-testament medieval-syle doctrines" is as conceptually impossible as surpassing the speed of light.
PS "tiny Minorities" of extremists translates into of Millions in a domain of 1.6 Billion that composed of other supporters according to varying degrees extremism.
What is this "radical Islam" bull dookey?
"Radical Islam" is redundant, and people who don't understand that are dangerously ignorant. Islam is a social system, not a religion. It encompasses politics, economics, law, science, the spiritual – everything. Saying Islam isn’t bad because most Muslims aren’t terrorists completely misses the point: Muslims by definition support the imposition of Sharia law and the destruction of every aspect of social order that doesn’t conform to Islam.
It appears to me they found a toy-makers home, and by the looks of it, he was doing quite well :)
Thank you. I had thoughts along a similar tangent. Why is every structure that is dug up immediately labeled as a sacred temple? Were there no children's toys? Did no one ever build a structure with east-facing windows that wasn't a temple because.... they wanted daylight?
Years from now they'll dig up a bunch of McDonalds and label them temples and the happy meal toys as relics of the gods.
Yeah... I was thinking that they found a home where a mom was having trouble finding something for a few 6 yr olds to do.
Savvy Shopper, many years ago when King Tut's stuff was touring thru the US, Readers Digest had an article called "Toot and come Inn" that was a spoof of exactly what you are talking about. It was a motel that had a man lying in bed in his underwear with a TV remote and a woman in the bathtub wearing a shower cap with sequins. They made the whole thing into religous artifacts and ancient symbols. The shower cap was "adorned with jewels" etc etc. It was quite funny.
@BCisinNV
If this was the toy makers home, and if he was doing so well, then why are the figurines still there? Wouldn't they have been sold and placed at other locations? By them being all in there says he didn't sell many.
As the religions loose members, sociologists have noted that the supposed secular activities of sports, Hollywood, and advertising have taken on ritual significance.
Do an image search on comedian Marty Feldman -- he looks exactly like that sculpture. Maybe they found the remains of a comedy club.
Or it was children who made the artifacts. Just saying they look darn crude....
Some of the figurines represented animals — mainly horses in harnesses— while others were humanlike heads with curling hair and flat headdresses. Such figurines hint at the influence of Philistine coastal culture.
Actually this article clears up nothing and to this 3rd party reader suggests the Jewish people were also settlers.The only hope for peace in the middle east is for both sides to give up their respective bellicose attitudes
The a...holes currently living in that region clearly deserve what they have. Both sides act like animals.
I wish we could spray an amnesia bomb over the whole area, then, while everybody is unconscious, destroy all temples and mosques, mix up the people and all their children into random groups (maybe include some contraceptive injections), shave all their hair and beards, dress them all in the same clothes, and see if that helps.
The Holy Koran predicted this.
The Koran predicted this 2700 yrs ago? Good trick when you figure that Islam as a religion has only been around about 1400yrs.
you mean they had 1300 years of peace...nupe they was killing each other for the hell of it back then too...
Hey , you're an Atheist. You know nothing. All I can say is : Madelyn O'Hare.
Having been to Israel, I can say this would never have seen the light of day without the Israelis. I love seeing the photos of the artifacts and the actual ruins. Wonderful finds.
See there! That proves all the Bible is true, from the talking snake to the 666 we see tattooed on the heathen's forehead!
It is interesting how they reference the Bible as if it is a road map to understanding different periods and kingdoms/ religious practices. They can divine the age or approximate the age of the temple based on certain events that are documented in the Bible. It is marvelous how all of the archeological finds and discoveries in that region fit in perfectly with the events recorded in the scriptures, and always have. The Bible truly is a living work and a tool for mankind to understand vast mysteries of the past present and future. Keep digging Israel!
Nah. You seem to be researching sites that have a theological agenda. Check the objective science on the date of the fall of Jericho. Wood, for example, is a believer more than he is a scientist. Of course, that depends on what you want to believe.
While one must research farther, and I have, you can find the controversy and appropriate links for further research at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Jericho .
Quote from the site: "In 1995, Kenyon's result was corroborated by radiocarbon tests which dated test samples taken from the site to 1562 BCE (plus/minus 38 years) with a certainty of 95%. The specific charcoal sample Wood referenced in his proposition was found to be in error and corrected to 1590 or 1527 +/- 110 BCE." That also would put the exodus from Egypt at around 1660 to 1597. Guess what? No evidence to support it.
Thus, I prefer to trust objective science. That way, I don't have to twist logic into a pretzel in order to rectify real science with the Bible. "
Mike the daily horoscopes work the same way
European Americans slaughtered buffalo into near extinction as a form of genocide against the Native American's food supply. Years from now someone will dig up bones and an unrelated book that references Mad Cow Disease, carbon date both of them to within a 200 +/- year time frame and make a false deduction the same as you, even though it "fits" perfectly.
One obeservation I would make about this find -
It was a pagan temple in the general area that dates back to Jerusalem circa 750 BCE. This was smack in the middle of the period where worship of (Jehovah/Yahweh/Yehovah/Jehoweh, aka "The Jewish God represented by the tetragramatin") was mostly abandoned in favor of the gods in the surrounding pagan lands. Incidentally, this is also roughly during the time period when most Biblical scholars agree that Isaiah, Micah, and Hosea were completed - prophetics books that contained strong deunciations against pagan worship and pleas to return to the Jewish God.
So, a temple dedicated to non-Jewish pagan worship from 750 BCE fits well with what was known of the time period.
@Hobbes Notes
Since when did Wikipedia become an objective source of information on contraversial topics?
@ Will-1091847, Do you have a problem with reading comprehension? I stated that Wikipedia provided the links for further research, which I followed. Where is your intellectual curiosity? Why don't you go to the site and follow the links, from which you can dig even further. I never take wikipedia's word for anything before I vet the information. I know you believers seem to have a serious problem with objective research, but I follow the real science. That is intellectual honesty.
@Hobbes' Notes; Because most colleges and universities will not accept wikipedia as a credible source.. Also, if the wiki is slanted to a certain opinion the sources usually are as well..
Intellectual Honesty, bwahahahahhaha!!
For goodness sakes, Dave-2478570, I have said twice that the page provides links for further research! YOU DON'T STAY ON THAT PAGE AND YOU DON'T REMAIN IN WIKIPEDIA!!!! You dig further. Each page to which you link provides other links and you can even find original sources that way. Wake up!
And, yes, Dave, your condescension shows you up the intellectually dishonest person you are, because you don't bother to vet information provided. Just like all Tea Party types.
No, Wikipedia cannot be used in citations of references for college papers and projects. (Neither can the Readers Digest.) But anything can be used to find research sources. This is fine in any school. So just because it is not allowed in an academic paper or journal does not mean that everyone has to be afraid of what it says. Because after all, the college hallways have their own fair share of liars and cheats.
fgh, what is the matter with you people? You are the third one who does not understand what I wrote. YOU DON'T STAY ON WIKIPEDIA! YOU FOLLOW LINKS WHICH OFTEN TAKE YOU TO ORIGINAL SOURCES. YOU CITE THE ORIGINAL SOURCES AND OTHER AUTHORITATIVE SCIENCE SOURCES!!!! ARE YOU PEOPLE COMPLETE IDIOTS?
No wonder you believe the bible to be the word of some god. You have absolutely no reading comprehension! Geeeze!
Hobbes' Notes, what did I write that makes you think that I do not support what you state?
fgh; How embarrass-king!--as Popeye would say. I misread your comment, then went into a tirade about reading comprehension. My bad! I was indeed careless, taking your first line as more of the same crap I'd been getting, then hastened through it. My apologies. :(
@Hobbes' Notes: you did not comprehend my original post..
You keyed in on what you wanted to make an argument out of...
I reiterate; Intellectual Honesty, bwahahahahaha!!
Dave, that's the way mindless zealots work. They find one little thing they disagree with and turn into raving lunatics who froth at the mouth to prove themselves "right."
I just love how Hobbes ran with it and spouted his political opinion along side just to make a spectacle of himself. Maybe it'll humble him a bit and we'll have to put up with less of it in the future... Naw... zealots aren't humbled for long.
2710 years before the first Palestinian was invented!
but it's not a jewish temple....
it was the temple of the obamamites...they had money to burn...and never worked a day in their lives...they went bankrupt before they had banks...
Plain Bob? From your post it suggest that you are still hurt in reguards to our president. So perhaps you should change your name to Salty Bob.
Merry Christmas to all.
Happy Holidays To All !!
seasons greetings...
and to all a good night.
And to all.....piss off!
I hope America stops giving money to Israel so the fools backing that bigot, racist state can support their own self important fantasies out of their own pockets. Following the masturbating arguments given here everyone should just pick up and leave America so the Indians can have it back because they were here first. Oh I forgot god didn't give the land to them so it's ok to take it.
U apparently have never studied history. The so called Native Americans came to the US via the land bridge between Russia and Alaska.
So sad for you to think you can take land simply because God didn't give you permission to take it.
It sounds as if you should live the remainder of you life without the benefits of "Jewish" medicine, science, music, engineering, art and literature. Please let us know how many more weeks you live. You know, maybe go live in an Islamic hell hole, where things are nice and peaceful and you can share your anti Semitism with your camelphile buddies.
Am not anti-semitic, I am against any group who claim to be "chosen" over us all by an another absent deity.
Pray Hard,
Your hatred is showing again...
luis
all religions make the same claim. Schools, businesses, states, There are thousands of things that claim superiority to other things. Get real........
Luis-4318737 I would suggest you are indeed biased here. You use of the term 'chosen' is showing such, as you think it is a placing of a people upon a pedestal; it is not. It means chosen to bear the burden of G-d, not to have everything handed to said people; quite the opposite, actually. BTW, just for the record, I am not a religious person, but rather am a professional scientist working in the field of non-thermal plasma physics; I have no religious affiliation.
Your*
Just because the righteous think reading ancient goat herders scribbles makes you better then the rest of humanity is a problem that retards the human race as a whole. What hubris to think that a tribe in the dessert has all the answers to life's problems in one book. I did not come up with the term "chosen" they call themselves that. Our fanatics in this country force us to spend time and energy dealing with that scrap of land because they believe that their deity can't come back until the Jews build the temple for a third time. Who's crazy? Who's biased? Who has the superiority problem. Hell jewish women can't even pray at the Wall over there, burden of a deity indeed.
"reading ancient goat herders scribbles"
Yes, THEY are the ones suffering from hubris.
Small carved figurines. Raised square platforms. Decorated pedestals. Supply rooms.
I believe it was a toy store.
You could be right. In fact it might have been an early workshop for Santa's elves. I mean no disrespect at all. As I wrote above, it is amusing how any artifacts found at new sights are nearly always proclaimed as ritual items, or religious items. Why not simply say they were toys, or household decorative items, or better yet just say they are items of a certain period of time and leave it at that?
Me thinks the term 'ritual' makes the items seem more important somehow.
Future historians will dig up a Punch and Judy doll set and puppet stage box and associate it with either Stonehenge or Dr. Who's police box.
I remember a satire somewhere, which declared that eons from now, today's toilet seats will be pronounced religious neck collars.
Are any of you trained archeologists?
We are fortunate to live in times, when people can do research and excavations around the world, into ancient civilizations, including this newly found temple. Being able to have access to vast areas of information and technology and science to unlock clues and information in ways impossible even 25 years ago.With computers and satellites assisting to enable connections and discoveries to be made never dreamed of before. Opening windows, glimpses into the cultures, through the artifacts and structures found. Be common items, religious,commerce goods,mosaic floors or even the most humble cast off garbage heaps.
Meanwhile, People can choose to argue, fight, bully and attack each other over the importance, worth, or rights of what is found. Disputing or trying to settle questions countries have fought far too long to find.
These sites do at least provide one simple fact that is hard to ignore. No matter where one goes in this incredible world where man has lived, as far back as we can find, he has left his mark.In all that time, he hasn't really changed. He is no wiser, more intelligent, kinder, peaceful nor more understanding with his fellow man. As proof, just look at peoples responses to this latest find. I suspect people have actually gotten worse.
This area is so rich in artifacts and history I wish they would consider stopping or halting new construction altogether. Isn't it amazing what they find, but then again if it were not for this construction, it never would have been found. Keep up the good work and let us know more pieces to the puzzle of mankind.
What, Muslims haven't claimed it yet? They'll either claim it, swear their ancestors built it or vow to destroy it.
More Hatred?
Surely you are not spending you holidays working for the Tel Aviv propaganda agency? Stop wasting your time, you are only making a fool of yourself.
"And I, YAHWEH Will Ordain a Place for My People Israel and Will Plant them and they Shall Dwell in THEIR Place and Shall Be Moved NO More, neither Shall the children of wickedness waste them anymore, as they did in the beginning." I Chronicles 17:9 "In this House and in Jerusalem, which I, YAHWEH have chosen out of All the Tribes of Israel, will I put My Name Forever. Neither will I, YAHWEH make the people of Israel move anymore out of this Land which I Gave THEIR Fathers." 2 Kings 21:7-8 "Sarah shall have a son and He shall be called Isaac and I, YAHWEH Will Establish My Coveneant with Him for an EVERLASTING Covenant and with his children after Him." Genesis 17:9 The Land of Israel did, is now and Will Forever Belong to the Jewish People, because YAHWEH has said it and HE Will carry it out.
God gives out perpetual land deeds? Who would have guessed ! With all the graven images they fond, this can not be a Jewish site, so it must be Palestinian.
Who cares?
These types of discoveries are always very intriguing to me....So much culture and history. I often wonder.... what legacy we will leave behind when we are gone? What will we be remembered for ?
The age of greed on steroids. The begining of the end of humanity.
Good question PV - If you read comments by Ron, Max, Dan, JP, etc, you will know that we will leave behind a legacy of hatred towards other human beings.
I would say that learning about history and discovering what people did and how they lived years ago is a good thing. In addition, hopefully we learn from their mistakes and make a better world now. Unfortunately judging by some of the posts here and elsewhere on MSNBC that is not happening. Too much hate and very little forgiveness.
Olddog
You are right! we are just fallible, egocentric, human beings. In the future, we will inhabit a distant planet and there will be people ruling over other people because they are "Special", Perhaps another group of "Chosen Ones" who claim a special and unique interest by the God of the Universe.
HOPE "it is amusing how any artifacts found at new sights are nearly always proclaimed as ritual items, or religious items."
It is fairly well know that that the current Israeli government does exactly that to keep the interest of Western Christians and to play it out to gain their support from the US government in military aid, foreign aid and Defense treaty matters. Before the tourists flight leaves a tourist minister speaks to the tourists how it relies on their help to defend the country and what a rocky, sandy, barren country it is to defend. One has to ask the question, "If the Jews were not living there would the Arabs even come to get a piece of it".
Yank,
Yes the Arabs would, for the same reason the jews love it... the beaches!
The Palestinians and Jews are genetically similar. The fact that both of their ancestors occupied the land is not surprising. Does it offer a solution to the current plight of the Palestinians? No.
Who cares?
Both of their ancestors? They have the SAME ancestors. Abraham must be weeping wherever he is, that his posterity have so much hatred and selfishness in them (and may I also point out that the Iranians/Persians, which also were Abraham's ancestors, and the other Middle East countries, the children of Abraham by his first and third wives, have little concern for their minority populations, but are driving them out of their borders?)
Elkmeadow,
I don't believe there is any evidence for a historical, Moses and Abraham. Aside from that, We are all descendants of the jews. remember the lost tribes? God created the earth, spit in dirt and sculpted Adam and Eve, our biblical grand parents. (har, har).
Luke,We are all genetically simalar,So?
I was hoping when I saw this discussion it would be about the site and not religion
The jews and the palestinians belong to the semites, a larger group which includes several other groups of southwestern Asian peoples, including arabs and syrians among others.
The figurine heads look a bit like Marty Feldman. Maybe this was an early comedy club and those were souvenirs.
What makes anyone think that these clay images to be Jewish? Do they have little stars of David embossed on their bottoms? Or is it just the location in which they were found. Is it possible that some other culture that predated the Jews was responsible for the images. The Jews could have come along out of the desert after the previous people disappeared. Which would mean that a god did not give the land to the Jews but to a prior civilization.
God never gave anybody anything; Man taketh from everybody, the weak perish and the strong warriors rule. Ask any native American "Indian". Israel is in a good place to have The United States of Israel as their ally ( because of the jewish lobbyists in Washington! )
i guess everyone who read the word "philistines" has absolutely no concept who they were. i believe there is some thought that they were one of the stronger factions of the sea peoples, not sons of abraham.
interestingly enough, there is also thought celts were also one of the stronger factions of the sea peoples. some well known individuals of the sea people invasions of the eastern mediterranean, are also considered to be leading characters in homer's 2 most famous writings.
the sea peoples can make very interesting reading.
please forgive me, its just the topic of the history of the levant is one of those things that draws like two ends of a magnet.
i hope this is not boring.
that said, it is interesting, YHWH in genesis chapter 15, 16, 17 promised to abraham, a son born of sarai (aka isaac) would be a key player in the abrahamic covenent. in addition, ishmael, born from hagi of abhraham - yes, the rules and culture were different then - would become a "great nation".
scholars will tell us, the hebrews are decendent of isaac and the arabts are decedent of ishmael.
today, what do we see with regards to those who still follow the abrhamic covent and what do we see as to those who populate and control large portions of the middle east ?
for better or for worse, it is what it is.
this is not even the tip of the iceberg with regard the history of not only a close near sited view of the levant but of all outsiders with a contributing influence there.
Dave, I agree with you about the Philistines. They were probably Semites, if we want to use that word to characterize "race." However, the Celts were indeed ancient and yes, they were adventurers and I have read that later in their history (still B.C., btw) they had been actively involved with trade in the Middle East. It stands to reason that they intermingled with other Semites there. The Philistines, as a an identifiable group appear to be extinct for over 2,000 years, however.
Additionally, archaeologists have found artifacts on the Eastern coast of North America, that indicate that the Israeli traders of the Third Century B.C. era had literally reached that coastline. Perhaps it was a heritage from the sea traders.
I suppose you know that the name of the Philistines was denigrated by the Middle Eastern and especially the Greek and Roman impacts there. Even today the word "philistine" is a word active in our English language and is rather insulting. It's used to describe a "person who is hostile or indifferent to culture and the arts, or who has no understanding of them."
If we look at Ireland today, I have read that the Celtic population is still there (despite numerous attempts at conquest by Scandinavian, Germanic, Norman, and earlier Anglo-Saxon invasions); the Celtic thread, I think, remains evident.
The Celts do not appear to have died out... if only in the gifts with which they are credited. But then, no human being on Planet Earth today is other than a mixed ancestry these days. The "races" no longer exist as when delineated by Johan Friedich Blumenbach, in 1779, as Caucasian (white), Mongolian (yellow), Malayan (brown), Negroid (black), and American (red).
Still, there is ongoing controversy among modern scientific hypotheses that, I think, supports the contention that "races" no longer exist as originally propagated. Who's to say otherwise? Ultimate proofs are absent; speculation yet abounds.
Funny whenever I see a headline of a tomb or archaeological find I hope in reading further it's something in Egypt, Mayan or South African, then I click on the article and see more Jewish crap and don't even bother reading it. I think that comes from I couldn't give a crap about anything else to do with anything that has to do with the whole Jesus story and all the BS that was written in the bible. I mean the story has been played out for all its worth. Show me a people that believed in something in the stars or a some markings on the planet that show something of substance once came to Earth. Not a bunch of assumptions written by a bunch of Jews with a talent for writing fiction..
Once upon a time the Gideon Bible was in all hotel rooms. Once upon a time most people in the "Western World were Christians". Now you can say BS to all that crap. It was BS in the 50s as well but there was no WWN to anonymously express those views. The Net will destroy faith as well as promote a more complete understanding of science. Archaeology is just a science. For those who have devoted their lives to it this study, they more justifiably can say BS to you. For a guy like me I never liked people who shot off their mouths without thinking. Think more rationally before you post again. This poster never searches the WWN for what truly interest her/him. Not a very trustworthy person.
However you look at it Jews are good writers. Look at Seinfeld, Larry David, Woody Allen and all the Jews that write sitcoms in Hollywood. It was Jews that wrote the Bible and added all the fat to the stories to make them more interesting. There was no parting sea, no commandments, no burning bush. the resurrection and sure as hell no massive Ark. It's all fabricated to make things sound more interesting and to create a faith that people should fear. Just as authors today write "unauthorized biographies" and novels " based on a true story" so did the Jew when they kept adding to The Bible. It sells publications today. Not that The Bible ever had a price tag on it but just as Mussolini of Italy was fixed on archeology finds in Rome due to he wanted the county to have a way to live labor free with a huge tourism industry so were the Jews hoping to create a sort of Disneyland of Jerusalem all based on selling coffee mugs, candles, t shirts and whatever other souvenirs that could sell in the supposed land where some guy named Jesus was born..
hmmm you have a point.. the New Testament, which is Christian oriented, was written by Jews...
Interesting, wouldn't you say???? :)
The Bible, regardless of your beliefs, is, to me, an incredibly beautiful allegory of human development. I treasure it for that reason alone (and I prefer the King James because of the exquisite language ... of the Shakespearean era.)
Unless history is lying, it was the Arabs, under the corrupt regime of Sultan Mehmed II, that bombarded Constantinople and murdered everyone in the city that actually gave Arabs a foothold in the Middle East. How this is overlooked and the carnage under the name of Allah continues blows my mind.
Read your history again....
I've not only "read the history" but have done in-depth research on the area. Islam (the religion and culture) did not come near Constantinople until the 7th and 8th Centuries A.D. (some call this the Common Era or C.E.).
The debate here seems to be about modern Israel's right to exist. Since history proves that the Hebrew/Jewish/Israeli populations have occupied their settlements in the area that is Judea today for over 4,000 years, and so who were there first is really not arguable. They approximated and influenced modern civilization of today.
No other genetic groups have accomplished that in the Western world.
You have to see the difference between tribes of Arabs which were basically nomadic, and a religious culture which unified large numbers of those Arabian tribes so that they stayed in one place. The Arab tribes are also Semitic according to popular science. The issue, however is who has the right to be there and whose culture has a right to prevail.
Unfortunately, in today's world that cultural issue has devolved into political power-mongering based, (oddly to me), on the religious aspects of the cultures.
The "conquerors," the Islamics, who date from only 1,500 years ago, did not displace the already existing Hebrews, and for the early years they actually, for the most part, lived in peace with one another as the Muslims established small settlements of their own.
We have to choose a side? Well, history establishes that the Jewish tribes settled cohesively in the Middle East first and those settlements survived through the ages down to today
...that is, an early, cohesive civilization that has progressed far in advance of the wandering tribes.
The founders of Islam like to be rewritten by Islamics today, because their Theocracies are politically based and they think they conquered all the Middle East. History does not support this.
However, "who's on first" is not, in my opinion, the issue. The recent, yet still primitive civilization in this day and age, cannot prevail in a modern world because, simply, in my opinion, their extremists are power-driven and very much out of touch with the democratic Western world.
Because the Israelis have a historic and also a contemporary right to their land, I wish, indeed that the self-styled Palestinians themselves could do their homework. They should study the Balfour Declaration (1917), and the Oslo Accords (1993 ff) to which they agreed but ignored subsequently, with rockets and bombs against the citizens of their neighbor. Get with the facts. These hot attacks lasted throughout the 20th century... almost 100 years in spite of their defeat (the fall of the Ottoman.. Islamic ... Empire in WW I).
The Islamic culture is a political base alien to democracy. They have a right to their culture; but not by terrorism against Israel which they abuse. Their culture is Primitiveness which relies on Terrorism by their extremists. The Israels culture is Democracy, which tries to protect all their citizens today, Jews, yes, but they also protect both Muslims and Christians.
That's why I vote to help protect modern democracy in the Middle East while respecting the theocracies there also. The rules are, in my book, to each his own, but that does not sanction the vicious attacks on a civilized country of folks there from the dawn of our time as proven by archaeology.
Who's on first? History answers that, indisputably.
@SecondSight
Incredibly well stated, tremendous, kudos to you.
Second,
Conveniently, you forgot to mention how the Israelis use terrorism and assassinations against their British occupiers or how Zionism was declare to be racism and a form of racial discrimination in the 1976 UN resolution 3379 ... Also forgetting to mention the massive contributions from Persians/Arabs to science, astronomy, astrology, navigation, architecture, literature and tolerance and coexistence with other religions/cultures ( Kingdom of Al-Andalus, Andalusia, Southern Spain)...